COM1

[[e-mail]]

PDOS only knows how to read/write floppies
and hard disks. Not USB sticks.

But that's OK, modern computers will take
care of converting a USB stick into either a
hard disk or a floppy disk, so I don't have to
change my code. That's great.

Now I'd like to be able to have a standalone
fairly modern (last 20 years) computer that
allows me to bang away at COM1 and have
that automatically converted into some sort
of network connection using the computer's
Wifi link/wireless network card.

So I have a hard disk and a COM port on a
computer with no hard disk and no COM
port.

Without running anyone else's software such
as VMWare or Bochs.

Sure, the computer has firmware that does the
equivalent, but I don't care about that. I will select
the computer based on the firmware.

Do any such computers exist? Or did they exist
in the last 20 years?

Thanks. Paul.

[JJ]

Post by ***@gmail.com
But that's OK, modern computers will take
care of converting a USB stick into either a
hard disk or a floppy disk, so I don't have to
change my code. That's great.

AFAIK, it only work if if the USB stick is not wiped clean with zeroes, and
the USB stick is used for the boot device.

Post by ***@gmail.com
So I have a hard disk and a COM port on a
computer with no hard disk and no COM
port.

Your definition of "COM port" is too vague.

A computer can have no physical COM port/socket, but still has a serial port
controller. e.g. onboard serial port controller where physical COM ports are
provided by motherboard pins, but nothing is attached to the pins.

Also, computers have BIOS/firmware code for accessing COM ports _as if_
there's actually a serial port controller present (assuming that the
firmware is a legacy BIOS, or EFI firmware with legacy BIOS support). Those
code would be useless if there's no serial port controller in the first
place.

[wolfgang kern]

On 27.05.2021 17:31, ***@gmail.com wrote:

[IDE-HD and serial COM]
...

Post by ***@gmail.com
Sure, the computer has firmware that does the
equivalent, but I don't care about that. I will select
the computer based on the firmware.
Do any such computers exist?

No more. SATA-only and USB-only since long.

Post by ***@gmail.com
Or did they exist in the last 20 years?

I found one motherboards with a COM-port 15 years ago.
but you can check on Super-I/O or similar fancy named.
__
wolfgang

[Rod Pemberton]

On Fri, 28 May 2021 07:25:57 +0200

Post by wolfgang kern
[IDE-HD and serial COM]
...

Post by ***@gmail.com
Sure, the computer has firmware that does the
equivalent, but I don't care about that. I will select
the computer based on the firmware.
Do any such computers exist?

No more. SATA-only and USB-only since long.

Post by ***@gmail.com
Or did they exist in the last 20 years?

I found one motherboards with a COM-port 15 years ago.
but you can check on Super-I/O or similar fancy named.

FYI for Paul,

My 2006 motherboard (MSI) had a serial
port and a parallel port. My 2009 (Gigabyte)
motherboard doesn't have either.

So, somewhere between 12 to 15 years ago is a
rough translation of wolfgang's "since long".

:)


Extra info:
The 2009 motherboard added integrated video
(DVI-D, HDMI, D-sub-15), eliminated a PS/2 port
(just one), and added many more USB ports to
the back panel. Both have Ethernet and audio.
Both have SATA, PCI, PCIe, and USB. Both have
IDE and floppy. The 2009 motherboard has half
as many PCI, PCIe, and DIMM slots.

[James Harris]

Post by Rod Pemberton
On Fri, 28 May 2021 07:25:57 +0200

Post by wolfgang kern
[IDE-HD and serial COM]
...

Post by ***@gmail.com
Sure, the computer has firmware that does the
equivalent, but I don't care about that. I will select
the computer based on the firmware.
Do any such computers exist?

No more. SATA-only and USB-only since long.

Post by ***@gmail.com
Or did they exist in the last 20 years?

I found one motherboards with a COM-port 15 years ago.
but you can check on Super-I/O or similar fancy named.

FYI for Paul,
My 2006 motherboard (MSI) had a serial
port and a parallel port. My 2009 (Gigabyte)
motherboard doesn't have either.
So, somewhere between 12 to 15 years ago is a
rough translation of wolfgang's "since long".

Are you guys saying modern machines don't have COM ports? Tom's Hardware
has just published a review of a motherboard which does.


https://www.tomshardware.com/uk/news/asrock-launches-thin-itx-amd-x300-motherboard

And, FWIW, there are motherboards with COM port headers. They can have
an attached port such as


https://www.ebuyer.com/223494-startech-com-16in-40cm-9-pin-serial-male-to-10-pin-motherboard-header-plate9m16

Though maybe you are talking about something else.

[Rod Pemberton]

On Mon, 31 May 2021 19:58:48 +0100

Post by James Harris

Post by Rod Pemberton
On Fri, 28 May 2021 07:25:57 +0200

Post by wolfgang kern
[IDE-HD and serial COM]
...

Post by ***@gmail.com
Sure, the computer has firmware that does the
equivalent, but I don't care about that. I will select
the computer based on the firmware.
Do any such computers exist?

No more. SATA-only and USB-only since long.

Post by ***@gmail.com
Or did they exist in the last 20 years?

I found one motherboards with a COM-port 15 years ago.
but you can check on Super-I/O or similar fancy named.

FYI for Paul,
My 2006 motherboard (MSI) had a serial
port and a parallel port. My 2009 (Gigabyte)
motherboard doesn't have either.
So, somewhere between 12 to 15 years ago is a
rough translation of wolfgang's "since long".

Are you guys saying modern machines don't have COM ports? Tom's
Hardware has just published a review of a motherboard which does.

I was saying my two motherboards didn't have them, and was assuming
they'd been removed. (more below)

Post by James Harris
And, FWIW, there are motherboards with COM port headers. They can
have an attached port such as

Sorry, I didn't think to look for a pin header ... I'll check.

Yes, the 2009 motherboard has a pin header for a serial COM port.

So, they both have a COM port, but the 2009 needs the "header plate"
adapter. The 2009 doesn't have a pin header for the parallel port, nor
a back panel connector, i.e., no parallel port.

Looking at two random new motherboards images, one on Gigabyte and
another on Asus, both have the pin header for a COM port. So,
apparently, they removed the parallel port completely, and replaced the
COM port back-panel connector with a motherboard pin header.

A large U.S. computer store's website doesn't seem to list the
serial/COM port for the motherboard specifications I sampled.

More random checks of images on Gigabyte and Asus shows their
motherboards have the COM header.

For a sample of MSI motherboards, I can't tell from their low quality
images if there is a COM pin header somewhere ... I don't see it
and I don't see a blurry COM label somewhere either. Their online and
pdf specifications don't list a serial or COM port either. Using
Google, I found a 2017 motherboard of theirs with a COM port. The COM
port is listed in their specifications and is clearly visible for that
motherboard. I.e., possibility, MSI might've removed the COM port, at
least for certain motherboards or newer motherboards?

[Branimir Maksimovic]

Post by James Harris

Post by Rod Pemberton
On Fri, 28 May 2021 07:25:57 +0200

Post by wolfgang kern
[IDE-HD and serial COM]
...

Post by ***@gmail.com
Sure, the computer has firmware that does the
equivalent, but I don't care about that. I will select
the computer based on the firmware.
Do any such computers exist?

No more. SATA-only and USB-only since long.

Post by ***@gmail.com
Or did they exist in the last 20 years?

I found one motherboards with a COM-port 15 years ago.
but you can check on Super-I/O or similar fancy named.

FYI for Paul,
My 2006 motherboard (MSI) had a serial
port and a parallel port. My 2009 (Gigabyte)
motherboard doesn't have either.
So, somewhere between 12 to 15 years ago is a
rough translation of wolfgang's "since long".

Are you guys saying modern machines don't have COM ports? Tom's Hardware
has just published a review of a motherboard which does.
https://www.tomshardware.com/uk/news/asrock-launches-thin-itx-amd-x300-motherboard
And, FWIW, there are motherboards with COM port headers. They can have
an attached port such as
https://www.ebuyer.com/223494-startech-com-16in-40cm-9-pin-serial-male-to-10-pin-motherboard-header-plate9m16
Though maybe you are talking about something else.

My motherboard X470 K4 Gaming Fatality Asrock have headers for com ports...

[wolfgang kern]

On 31.05.2021 20:58, James Harris wrote:
...

Post by James Harris
Are you guys saying modern machines don't have COM ports?

YES!:) my preference for AMD on MSI show that there aren't COM anymore.
but there are I/O ports reserved for one COM in the south-bridge chip,
so MoBo manufacturer are free to use it or just disable and ignore it.

Post by James Harris
Tom's Hardware has just published a review of a motherboard which does.
https://www.tomshardware.com/uk/news/asrock-launches-thin-itx-amd-x300-motherboard
And, FWIW, there are motherboards with COM port headers. They can have
an attached port such as
https://www.ebuyer.com/223494-startech-com-16in-40cm-9-pin-serial-male-to-10-pin-motherboard-header-plate9m16
Though maybe you are talking about something else.

On my previous MSI there were one 10-pin connector labeled SUPER-I/O.
but my latest boards (2018) have none.
__
wolfgang

[Rod Pemberton]

On Thu, 27 May 2021 08:31:00 -0700 (PDT)

Post by ***@gmail.com
Now I'd like to be able to have a standalone
fairly modern (last 20 years) computer that
allows me to bang away at COM1 and have
that automatically converted into some sort
of network connection using the computer's
Wifi link/wireless network card.

Let's see what hardware can help you with that.


You can get serial port RS-232 cards for PCIe x1.

You can do RS-232C to Ethernet IP with an adapter.
Drop "RS232 to Ethernet IP" into Google.


You can get USB to Ethernet adapter cables.

You can get USB to serial port RS-232 cables
with drivers for Windows. (FYI, these are for
serial devices connected to a PC via USB, e.g.,
factory RS-232C compatible equipment, and are
NOT for converting a PC's RS-232 ports into USB
for connecting to a USB device.)


So, some options seem to be:

a) trap and redirect COM1 to Wifi
link/wireless network card

b) motherboard with serial ports,
plus RS-232 to Ethernet IP server

c) PCIe serial port card,
plus RS-232 to Ethernet IP server

d) trap and redirect COM1 to USB, plus a
USB to Ethernet adapter cable

[[e-mail]]

Post by ***@gmail.com
Now I'd like to be able to have a standalone
fairly modern (last 20 years) computer that
allows me to bang away at COM1 and have

I now have software that bangs away at COM1,
but it hasn't been tested (except on 16-bit Freedos
under Bochs). If someone with a real computer
and real serial port would like to test it, it is
available at http://pdos.org

Post by ***@gmail.com
that automatically converted into some sort
of network connection using the computer's
Wifi link/wireless network card.

Actually if the computer manufacturer can just give
me a link to my router, that would be good enough.
I could then buy my router based on whether it
supports an ATDE command or not.

Or if my computer manufacturer gives me a bluetooth
link to a smartphone, that would be good enough too.
Or even to my dumb phone for that matter.

My dumb phone (worth about US$10, provided for free
by Optus because they were sick of me using their 2G
network and forced me to move), has both bluetooth
and internet. Optus kicked me off their US$4/month
plan and put me onto a US$8/month plan, but in the
process they gave me internet access. I've never really
used the internet access, and I just checked now and
http://pdos.org works. https doesn't though, so when
Woolies asked me why I never clicked on the SMS link
to say I was on my way, I told them I was using a dumb
phone, and was happy to wait. If they sent me an email
link, I could click on that. But that may disappear too,
with the switch to PDOS. Note that at one point my
Windows Live Mail email stopped showing me my
orders, because they were an unsupported picture type,
but after some years Woolies went back to a supported
format, so I can see them again.

Who are these people who think they can invalidate my
software and get away with it? Don't they know that Jens
Stoltenberg is just a tweet away?

Anyway, if my dumb phone can route the bluetooth traffic
to whatever internet address I give it, we're in business.

I'm happy to use my wife's smartphone while waiting for
the dumb phones to get the extra 500 lines of code they
need to link up bluetooth (which they already support)
to internet (which they already support). Or for my
router to support the connection. Or for my BIOS to
support entering a particular URL to attach to COM1.

Doing SSL under the covers so that I have no way of
detecting the difference would be cool too. E.g. I try
to connect to port 80 of pdos.org (in my BIOS) but it
actually goes to port 443.

BFN. Paul.